jess - 1-07-07 - Gor 101
[21:21] (jesszabelle): ---`-,-{@-Tonight's Topic: Introducing Gor 101 -@}-,-`--- : How do we explain what Gor is in a friendly way to those who are interested without overwhelming them or immediately telling them they must read 26 books? How can we give an overview that allows them to judge if they're interested in continuing their explorations?--
[21:22] ({alyria}Gareth): this is going to sound so trite as to be ridiculous, but i learned it from hearing some big star who makes MUCH more money doing voiceovers than in her acting career say that saying things while smiling broadcasts positivity and warmth
[21:23] ({alyria}Gareth): and so, if someone comes in wanting to learn, remember how it felt and remember to think something warm or to smile while talking to them.
[21:24] (jesszabelle): makes sense.
[21:25] ({alyria}Gareth): i have a little bitty pet peeve about someone coming in and asking "What is Gor about?" and expecting to be spoonfed years of experience in a soundbyte.
[21:25] ({alyria}Gareth): and sometimes they won't even stay long enough to read my first post in response if it doesn't pop up in fifteen seconds or less.
[21:25] (feylin): if they came in here, the discussion boards might be a good direction to point them in...except a lot of the posts say "read the books"....but not all of them!
[21:26] ({alyria}Gareth): there has to be some middle ground between telling people to read 26 books, or even one for that matter, and being expected to spoon feed them, especially at two-freakin' a.m.
[21:26] (feylin): everyone starts somewhere.
[21:27] (feylin): lots of websites out there. Good or bad, tons of info.
[21:28] (feylin): i'm sure it is annoying, but they have to start somewhere? i am always in a room with people who know more than me, so i try not to interfere..unless like last night. <grins>
[21:30] ({alyria}Gareth): and some of the websites are a mixture of good info and really really bad info.
[21:34] (feylin): so..how do you explain Gor to people when experiences can be quite diverse?
[21:34] ({alyria}Gareth): i certainly do not think the paths i have taken are any kind of roadmap for someone else.
[21:34] ({alyria}Gareth): nooooooo, i have in some ways stayed in some of the swamp at times to hold up a lantern and warn people off some of the path i have taken.
[21:34] (jesszabelle): you start off saying that experiences can be quite diverse, i should think.
[21:35] (feylin): but i actually read someone experience which was very similar to what she described..and, well...i found it appealing, at least as described.
[21:35] (feylin): set aside the beating..i mean the structure.
[21:35] ({alyria}Gareth): it may sound a little zennish to say that we acknowledge our true/intended nature rather than conform to what the modern world would feed us.
[21:35] ({alyria}Gareth): achieve the balance between following our nature and imposing discipline on ourselves
[21:37] (wenchW): How do we explain what Gor is in a friendly way to those who are interested without overwhelming them or immediately telling them they must read 26 books?
[21:37] (wenchW): [21:33] Zedojehn: I would ditch the friendly
[21:37] (wenchW): [21:33] Zedojehn: and I would overwhelm them
[21:37] (wenchW): [21:33] Zedojehn: Cause only people with tough skin survive the truth
[21:38] (wenchW): edojehn: I think explaining a way of life is a better option without adding Gor into it, people need to understand that more than certain walks first
[21:38] (wenchW): [21:35] Zedojehn: you would include it in your conversations.. slowly build understanding.. while freaking them out at the same time
[21:40] (wenchW): [21:39] Zedojehn: I really think it is better for people to read the books, no matter how overwhelming it is
[21:40] (wenchW): [21:39] Zedojehn: form their own opinions, stop being sheep
[21:40] (wenchW): alyriaG: and there isn't like one definitive quote that says it ALL because Goreans are diverse
[21:41] (wenchW): wenchW: i disagree, though, with the necessity of reading the books right away before having any understanding of it at all
[21:42] (wenchW): wenchW: if i had just read the books, without the context of people i know and respect living it, it would of been lost on me
[21:43] (wenchW): *Zedojehn Yes thus the questions when needed*
[21:43] (wenchW): [21:41] Zedojehn: I think it is better to read with LIMITED input from others though
[21:43] (wenchW): [21:42] foxy: i agree
[21:43] (wenchW): [21:42] wenchW: i waited about 6 mos before picking up the first one
[21:44] (wenchW): foxy: learned by asking quistion and listening to others then pick up the books
[21:44] (wenchW): [21:43] Zedojehn: It is fine if people aren't pressing their own beliefs and understanding of it to the new person
[21:44] (wenchW): [21:43] wenchW: i didnt look for input from others on what i read...but integrated how they lived into what i was reading
[21:44] (wenchW): [21:43] Zedojehn: explaining something, answering a question.. is much different than trying to say, well this is what I think and it is the "right way" .. so to speak
[21:45] (wenchW): alyriaG: it's amazing how many two-bit "teachers" will show up--those are the ones to avoid.
[21:46] (wenchW): alyriaG: example, not preaching, is the best way to lead and to teach.
[21:46] (wenchW): [21:44] Zedojehn: yeah, not into preaching.. never liked church
[21:46] (wenchW): [21:45] foxy: nor do i
[21:47] (wenchW): alyriaG: to borrow a saying from my Master, "Don't tell me about the labor pains, show Me the baby!"
[21:47] * {alyria}Gareth chuckles that is a Garethism (TM)
[21:48] (Warlok2): well of course no man wants to hear how much it hurt comming out as he is going to be hurting for the next 18 years and I'm sure you don't want to hear about that.
[21:50] * {alyria}Gareth laughs
[21:50] ({alyria}Gareth): my 18 y/o might well see it that way, too.
[21:53] (Gareth_H): and yes..that is one of Mine
[21:55] (Gareth_H): the best thing.....that can be done.....to alleviate fears of the big bad Goreans...is to let them see who We are
[21:56] (Gareth_H): rather than hear about it....from the disgruntled..and the bratty
[21:56] (Gareth_H): and those who decide that they dont like what they find....are the first to spread horror stories
[21:57] (Gareth_H): Zed is right though...that a read of the books is of primary order....I do recommend a solid read at first instance.....
21:57] (Gareth_H): but I advise folks to read knowing they are not reading a blueprint for a day to day life
[21:58] (Gareth_H): but they are reading for a philosophy....and to keep in mind..that the characters are crafted to tell a rather long story....with a number of meanings
[21:58] (Gareth_H): and not just a little subtext
[21:59] (wenchW): Zedojehn: aye indeed, problems start when people think the books are the "only way" .. because obviously, life is a lot bigger than the books
[22:00] (Gareth_H): Truth is..no book....even if it was intended to...could capture an entire cultures...not even 26 of them
[22:00] (wenchW): alyriaG: and a few in the books are "larger than life"
[22:00] (wenchW): [21:58] foxy: oh i totally agree there
[22:00] (Gareth_H): The characters in the book..it must be remembered...are there to tell the story....they are crafted..not found
[22:01] (wenchW): Zedojehn: But that is why people should read and ask questions while they read
[22:01] ({alyria}Gareth): How long do we spend learning the basics, like reading, writing, science, math and manners and how to work? Years and years, and a lot of resources go into that.
[22:01] (wenchW): Zedojehn: help curb those who are getting lost in fantasy lol
[22:01] (Gareth_H): indeed..and hopefully...most people developing a philosophy...do so having read a bit more than 26 books
[22:01] (Gareth_H): although I swear I know some that have read maybe 5 in their entire life
[22:02] (Gareth_H): Mind you....I do know as well..that some rituals start in the books...and some have been added
[22:03] (Gareth_H): hell some of them I was involved in the adding thereto
[22:03] (wenchW): foxy: not only that the books cab be confusing and questions can help to understand then better
[22:03] (wenchW): [22:02] foxy: can
[22:03] (Gareth_H): so as well....the conversations on what is canon and what is not...sometimes are tedious to the point of ridiculousness
[22:04] (Gareth_H): to newcomers....this is at best confusing
[22:04] (Gareth_H): and thats on a good day :)
[22:05] (Gareth_H): When I run the Inn for instance....I am not dogmatic...I do what I think is best for Me....if folks like it...they stay...if they dont...I wish them well
[22:05] (Gareth_H): This surprises newcomers no end
[22:05] (Warlok2): it's worse than confusing especially if it appeals to you
[22:05] (Gareth_H): at least the ones who have heard the horror stories..and will presume I will grow a hump and become ogresque
[22:06] (Gareth_H): I dont do ogre very well
[22:06] * Warlok2 chuckles
[22:06] (Gareth_H): and it is the epitome of this Philosophy to be true to Ones nature
[22:06] (Gareth_H): although I have cut back on the public scratching
[22:06] (wenchW): Zedojehn: Agree's with Gareth.. I'm not here to please the masses or make things easy for lazy people
[22:07] (Gareth_H): the fact is....the cretins that generate horror stories are in fact basically lazy
[22:07] (Gareth_H): they want a kajira on the cheap...with no effort and no concerns
[22:08] (wenchW): well, i think thats true for some of the horror stories, not all, Master
[22:08] (Warlok2): well Gareth they get what they want though their property doesn't carry much value to others
[22:08] (wenchW): Zedojehn: I can't agree it is about being true to "ones" nature.. because one's nature may be to be a raging homosexual which to me is not fitting within Gor
[22:08] (wenchW): [22:07] foxy: the true is if someone wants to learn bad enought they hang around an learn from other but also get involed be joining in with quiestion and views
[22:09] (Gareth_H): almost nothing is true of all of anything...but by and large....even the truly harmful cretins..are basically lost in their own vanity and self gratification at all costs
[22:09] (Gareth_H): basically......lazy
[22:10] (wenchW): perhaps i was just thinking from the perspective of a girl that tries to please, and winds up blown away...
[22:11] (Gareth_H): Well as I say..and probably too often....the service is in the effort....those that dont see that..have not extended the effort to think beyond their own goodies
[22:11] (wenchW): alyriaG: Master Zedojen, I agree, and if that is a person's bent, they really should take it elsewhere, where THEY can be with THEIR likeminded people.
[22:11] (wenchW): [22:08] Zedojehn: I think being true to the nature of man as man was created.. kind of says it more suitably..
[22:11] (wenchW): [22:08] Zedojehn: (man including woman as well.. man as in "human" .. nature.. etc)
[22:11] (wenchW): [22:08] Zedojehn: lol
[22:11] (wenchW): [22:09] alyriaG: i'm not really comfortable with Women having Their boyslaves act like girls and for the Women to behave in Gorean places like Men.
[22:11] (wenchW): [22:09] alyriaG: there are other places to be
[22:12] (Gareth_H): Well lets NOT get Me started on FW......I ALWAYS get in trouble when We do that
[22:12] * puella smiles
[22:12] ({alyria}Gareth): those are NOT FW, IMHO.
[22:12] ({alyria}Gareth): or they wouldn't last long if the expectations of FW were really taken seriously.
[22:14] (Gareth_H): so...I suspect....in meeting new folks....the basics really apply...be polite unless given reason to be otherwise...be helpful when it makes sense to be so..and dont be an ass
[22:15] (Gareth_H): which by the way kajirae...does not preclude wiggling same
[22:15] (wenchW): Gareth_H> so...I suspect....in meeting new folks....the basics really apply...be polite unless given reason to be otherwise...be helpful when it makes sense to be so..and dont be an ass
[22:15] (wenchW): [22:13] Zedojehn: Grins, so do I Gareth.. laughs
[22:16] (Gareth_H): Mind you...I do tend to have peeves when it comes to new folks
[22:16] (Gareth_H): occasionally...
[22:16] (wenchW): oh!...the "so do I" was on the FW comment...lol
[22:16] (Gareth_H): for an enlisted Man...The term Sir..is essentially an insult
[22:17] (Gareth_H): so unless and until I am made a knight of the Garter
[22:17] (Gareth_H): I will pass on being called that
[22:17] (Gareth_H): and even then.....I will explain it at least once
[22:17] (Gareth_H): In person....I wil say...dont call Me sir...I work for a living
[22:22] (jesszabelle-tsh): regarding my suggestion of contrasting Gor with what it is not... with BDSM and D/s, a context that they are generally familiar with, a shorthand of communication as it were. do y'all think that has any merit?
[22:22] (jesszabelle-tsh): if so, specifically how do we go about that?
[22:22] (jesszabelle-tsh): where do the differences lie?
[22:23] * Gareth_H ponders this
[22:23] ({alyria}Gareth): it depends on the mindset of the person who comes from the BDSM world--some are convinced that Gor is a "kink" that is a subset of BDSM. Some take the view that it is apples and oranges, having some things in common and some things not in common.
[22:24] ({alyria}Gareth): both are good things that can be roundish and held in the hand, but apples are not a subset of oranges.
[22:24] (wenchW): Zedojehn: No, no no... contrast is where blending starts
[22:24] (wenchW): [22:23] Zedojehn: Even if the intention is to show what is NOT the same... people's minds will do with it what they choose, which in most cases is softening shit to fit them
[22:25] (Gareth_H): I am fond of round things that can be held in the hands
[22:25] (wenchW): wenchW: i define BDSM and D/s differently than most i talk with
[22:28] (wenchW): to me, BDSM is just a set of activites...not a lifestyle....leather folk can do BDSM or not, so can Goreans, so can "vanilla folk"
[22:30] (wenchW): some speak of D/s as "not-Gorean"...to me it is any relationship of Dominance and submission, it may be Gorean or far from it, or somewhat similar
[22:31] ({alyria}Gareth): some say that all Gorean M/s relationships are a subset of TPE (total power exchange) BDSM.
[22:32] (wenchW): thats a confusion of terms to me, alyria...TPE BDSM...why not just say TPE?...BDSM is what they might do or not in bed or wherever
[22:32] (wenchW): Zedojehn: I think of bdsm as the kink, not the way a person lives day to day, D/s to me as it is presented --most of the time-- has more compromise, and is more give and take than M/s or "Gor"
[22:34] (wenchW): *Zedojehn bah TPE... snarls at the term.. chuckles*
[22:34] (wenchW): wenchW: i have met people that strongly identify with D/S that dont have any more give and take than Goreans do
[22:34] (wenchW): [22:33] alyriaG: i kind of choked on the term because if one party gives up all the power to the other party--where's the "exchange"?
[22:35] (wenchW): Zedojehn: Yeah thats why I said most of the time, wench
[22:36] (Gareth_H): and I am with Zed...TPE sounds like something I need to have shots for
[22:42] (wenchW): back on topic...ahem...one thing i find when talking to newbies is trying to not let what i like or dislike color what i say too much
[22:43] (Zedojehn): I attempt to do that wench, though I tend to like my colour and figure they should know about it
[22:43] * Zedojehn grins
[22:43] (Gareth_H): I am usually that way..unless they piss Me off :)
[22:43] (wenchW): MMMmmmm...likes your 'color' too, Master
[22:44] ({alyria}Gareth): This may be an alarming thing to say, but some people can come in and explore politely, see what it is and even appreciate it, and walk way without feeling it is their "cuppa tea."
[22:45] ({alyria}Gareth): and that isn't due to anyone's failure to explain or to treat them well.
[22:45] (wenchW): for instance if i tell a new girl Gor isnt about learning to post a beautiful serve, that i usually avoid rooms that want that, how do i know that thats not what the girl is seeking?
[22:45] (kittyspaz{S}t): aye, totally understand that!
[22:48] (Zedojehn): I had a dude once, when I actually bothered explaining things to idiots, before I learned to stop.. all he was interested in was when he could "own a slave"
[22:49] (Gareth_H): Oh now that I have heard before.....or ones that have tried to grab some girl on the first visit to one of My rooms
[22:49] (Gareth_H): not bloody likely
[22:49] ({alyria}Gareth): perhaps He should have hooked up over in one of the places where they just put on the collar for the night
[22:49] * Zedojehn Yes I bitchslapped that one.. he didn't deserve a manly punch
[22:50] (Gareth_H): Goes back to My previous advice.....dont be an ass
[22:50] (Zedojehn): unless you are naturally one
[22:51] (wenchW): what if someone isnt a total idiot...what if they just arent into the same style of learning, conversing or whatever that you are?
[22:52] (Zedojehn): They will likely still get bitchslapped wench, but in the right direction
[22:52] (wenchW): lol
[22:52] (kittyspaz{S}t): forwards?
[22:52] (Zedojehn): Is still stuck on the friendly part.. can you tell?
[22:52] ({alyria}Gareth): sometimes such a person might learn better with someone more sympatico with their style
[22:52] (Gareth_H): Shooting them in the face is frowned on :)
[22:52] (Zedojehn): lol
[22:53] (wenchW): aah, you dont gently pick them up, deliver them to the right room, and throw a party for them?
[22:53] (Zedojehn): No, is more direct to shunt them forcibly and keep the party for myself
[22:53] ({alyria}Gareth): if you think they rate that or Master commands it, wench.
[22:53] (kittyspaz{S}t): there ya go
[22:53] * {alyria}Gareth laughs
[23:04] (jesszabelle-tsh): What about your own introduction to Gor was great? What improvements would you make could you do it again?
[23:05] ({alyria}Gareth): it's a good idea to avoid using the "N" (newbie) word in addressing someone you are just meeting.
[23:05] (kittyspaz{S}t): see , i have been spoiled by ya'll
[23:06] (Zedojehn): Comradeship and colour... the disappearance of which had a hand in my decision to walk away and be who I am without the label.. grins
[23:06] (Zedojehn): as well as the fact it didn't change me.. but that's another story
[23:07] (kittyspaz{S}t): not sure i am following Master Zedojehn
[23:07] (Zedojehn): laughs, yes newbie is never a overly liked term in any venue
[23:07] (Zedojehn): oh I was just responding to what jess posted there
[23:08] (kittyspaz{S}t): aye
[23:09] ({alyria}Gareth): it may be my "style" to explore things on my own--i'm not sure there would have been a better way to "introduce" me to Gor. The thing speaks for itself. Maybe less drama between some personalities might have made part of the first couple of years a bit more pleasant, but i learned from those things as well.
[23:10] (Zedojehn): Well we learn from good and bad so they both have value, just some is more frustrating
[23:12] (wenchW): i remember my first exposure to "Gor" was gorons coming into D/s rooms that werent Gorean and expecting the girls there eto bow to them....
[23:13] ({alyria}Gareth): i had read three of the books years ago, borrowed them off a former b/f's bookshelf while visiting, and didn't put it together with what i saw online for quite some time.
[23:13] (wenchW): and 'kajira' that came in and put girs down that were "less" than them
[23:13] (Zedojehn): Now I have a vision of jess with a mohawk, doc martens and plaid tights
[23:14] (Zedojehn): unfortunately all of that still happens wench
[23:14] * {alyria}Gareth laughs and pushes the Birkies under the desk
[23:14] (wenchW): it was distaseful to me, and made accepting what can be beautiful about Gor harder
[23:15] (wenchW): so much so that when Master first went into a Gorean Home i freaked, and was ready to tell Him "this wont work out"
[23:15] ({alyria}Gareth): there are going to be two-percenters in any group, and there are going to be people who excel and who delight, no matter what philosophy they believe.
[23:15] (Zedojehn): people used to express themselves in words better here, it DID bring the beauty of offline, online. (in regards to what jess is saying)
[23:17] (Gareth_H): I have some small gift with a phrase or two :)
[23:17] * Zedojehn chuckles... >"<
[23:17] (Zedojehn): Well thanks for the visual!
[23:18] ({alyria}Gareth): one thing i liked was the order, the beauty of how people would express themselves, the (maybe an illusion) appearance of strength and courage.
[23:19] (Zedojehn): People were not afraid what everyone thought, weren't afraid of being labeled "fake or a roleplayer" for enjoying written word
[23:20] (Gareth_H): Well I have always been hesistant to lable folks......takes Me a bit to find even the most distasteful too much for Me
[23:20] (Gareth_H): but what folks do in their own places is their business...If I dont like what they do I just don go there
[23:20] ({alyria}Gareth): has "discussion" taken over and expanded beyond its intended role for learning, and done to online interactions what Casual Friday has done to every day of the week in offices all over?
[23:20] (Gareth_H): seems easier to Me
[23:21] (Zedojehn): Yes, alyria.. it has
[23:21] (Zedojehn): Yeah I just don't go where people do thing's I dislike generally Gareth
[23:22] (Zedojehn): And if they don't like my rooms, they can leave also.. heh heh
[23:22] (Gareth_H): over the years..I think I am MOST annoyed by people who come into My place and tell Me what I should be doing :)
[23:22] (Zedojehn): laughs, yep
[23:23] (Gareth_H): its a quick way to push all the wrong buttons with Me
[23:23] ({alyria}Gareth): there is the extreme in RP where you have to post "OOC" (out of character) to say anyting "real" and then some places where people confuse RP with being a "gamer" in the sleazy sense of that word.
[23:24] (wenchW): but doesnt there also have to be a place for those who dont express themselves in written serves and dances, etc?
[23:24] (Zedojehn): Not necessarily wench
[23:24] (Gareth_H): I suppose there can be...and more power to them....then can set up whatever they like to set up
[23:24] (Zedojehn): I see realistic r/p as fitting around conversation, just as it does offline
[23:25] (Gareth_H): but in the end...this is a text medium...so they best be able to do something in written form :)
[23:25] (wenchW): in my case preforming a creative serve or whatever o/l isnt pleasing to my Master...He prefers me just to converse
23:26] (Gareth_H): I dont find any fault with that
[23:26] (wenchW): i'm not saying to sit her silently, Master Gareth!
[23:26] (wenchW): here*
[23:26] ({alyria}Gareth): and your expressions of servitude and your service to your Master is not limited to typed text, either.
[23:27] (Zedojehn): Aye well that is service anyway... people think "service" only incorporates sex drinks and rock n roll.. or something
[23:27] ({alyria}Gareth): there are many more ways to please, to serve.
[23:27] (Gareth_H): bottom line is.......everytime someone types /me in IRC they are typically engaged in role play :)
[23:27] (wenchW): yet there's many rooms that they dont wish a girl's opinions or conversation....just her being 'busy'
[23:27] * Zedojehn chuckles, yep.. although I AM chucklin, so tis realistic.. grins
[23:27] (Gareth_H): well...those places bore Me :)
[23:28] (Zedojehn): heh heh
[23:28] * wenchW smiles....
[23:28] (Gareth_H): and I have been a part of them before
[23:28] (wenchW): i "roleplay" like that, i agree
[23:28] ({alyria}Gareth): i've been in some places as a Free where the girls were assigned online tasks and did them with the beauty and precision of synchronized swimming routines--it was lovely.
[23:28] (Gareth_H): and I usually had the nagging thought....why do We have them do this
[23:28] ({alyria}Gareth): gail would remember one of those places over at goreanchat.net
[23:29] (Zedojehn): Evenin', littlexmace
[23:29] (wenchW): i'm not saying it isnt lovely, or very pleasing to some...i'm not against it at all...but its not Master nor my "thing"
[23:29] (Zedojehn): When I slaves in my online room, they used to "float about" it doing such things, not set out tasks but just movement
23:30] ({alyria}Gareth): it's hard to create that quality i would call "ambience" in two word posts.
[23:30] (Gareth_H): if everyone liked the same things....We wouldnt need very many people
[23:30] (Zedojehn): slaves don't sit there idle unless told to, or brought into discussion etc
[23:30] (Zedojehn): (when I HAD slaves in my online room.. that should have said) laughs
[23:31] (Gareth_H): and sometimes....like last night.....I just want to have some fun
[23:32] (Zedojehn): Enjoys fun
[23:32] ({alyria}Gareth): one room cannot be all things to all people
[23:32] (Zedojehn): Stuck a slaves head in a dung sack once... probably wasnt fun for her though
[23:32] * Zedojehn erm
[23:32] (wenchW): lol, Master Zedojehn
[23:32] (Gareth_H): I can.....deal with the intensely serious....talk about many different aspects of the terminally grim...and rant endlessly about responsibility
[23:32] (Gareth_H): sometimes....I like pudding wrestling :)
[23:32] (Zedojehn): Indeed!
[23:34] ({alyria}Gareth): jess, sure you could! it takes focus to blend a goofball sense of humor with grace and sensuality.
[23:34] (wenchW): i know that about You, Master Gareth, and knowing that You (i think) appreciate my thoughts and conversation made participating in having fun like that something i wanted to please You with
[23:34] ({alyria}Gareth): and we can't function at that level of intensity every night of the week.
[23:35] (Gareth_H): indeed....and It was a fun evening
[23:35] (Gareth_H): most fun I have had in donkey's years
[23:35] (Gareth_H): I suppose in some regards...its like an RPG...with Chutzpah
[23:36] (Gareth_H): the actions are similar..but the meaning is I think deeper
[23:36] (Gareth_H): and in some regards....its a different sort of literary form
[23:37] (Zedojehn): Well it isn't simply "words on a screen"
[23:37] (Gareth_H): and I have seen on a number of occasions....such expressions that were well worthy of the term literary
[23:37] (Gareth_H): No and I was reading something the other day...where or when I cant remember
[23:37] ({alyria}Gareth): my Master, do You really think that any one of us has any real life experience pudding wrestling--that is part of the challenge and part of the charm.
[23:38] (Gareth_H): that talked about that We are not having an information revolution at all
[23:38] (Gareth_H): what we are having is a relationship revolution.....
[23:39] (Gareth_H): particuarly ironic as the books deal with a technologically stunded society......in ours....without the words on the screen..almost none of Us would even know each other
[23:39] (Gareth_H): stunted as well
[23:39] * {alyria}Gareth laughs--so you are off in the coolroom doing a splendid job and right before you hit "send" the drink has been consumed
[23:40] (Zedojehn): Well I knew about 2 Americans before
[23:40] (wenchW): lol...or you are bowing in offerance, and they leave....
[23:40] * Zedojehn laughs
[23:40] ({alyria}Gareth): here's a scary thought--seeing a picture of something creates a thought as real as seeing the object, according to experiments tracking what fires off in the brain.
[23:41] (Zedojehn): (Now I have to leave my messenger light off to get away from you all)
[23:41] ({alyria}Gareth): so this is a powerful medium
[23:41] * Zedojehn grins
[23:41] (Gareth_H): it is...and will be more so...and will change this culture in ways We cant even conceive of
[23:41] (Zedojehn): Well alyria, jess' punk vision was quite powerful here
[23:42] (Gareth_H): So....we form communities...being Gorean is one of them...its extended...at often at a distance...but the community is there
[23:42] * Zedojehn chuckles
[23:42] (Gareth_H): what new people need to see....and learn...is that We dont bite....
[23:42] (Gareth_H): well thats not true..We do bite....but you know what I mean
[23:43] * Zedojehn laughs... christ
[23:43] (Zedojehn): lol
[23:44] (Zedojehn): We bite in a self controlled manner?
[23:44] (Gareth_H): indeed...and always aware of our Honor in how We bite :)
[23:44] (Zedojehn): lol
[23:44] (wenchW): may i brb?...gotta get a few dishes done
[23:44] (Gareth_H): of course wench
[23:45] (Zedojehn): chinese whispers!
[23:45] ({alyria}Gareth): you name any group, i've heard a horror story about them
[23:46] (Zedojehn): (used to deliberately change the message.. when I was little that is.. I even had to dominate childhood chinese whispers)
[23:46] (Zedojehn): Yeah lol
[23:46] ({alyria}Gareth): we called it "gossip"
[23:46] (Zedojehn): I don't know why we call it chinese whispers, maybe we didn't trust them
[23:47] (Gareth_H): I think it is still common knowledge what I think about gossi[
[23:47] (Gareth_H): and or gossip
[23:48] ({alyria}Gareth): i have times i wish i could rejoin the "herd" and "pass" as "normal"
[23:48] (Zedojehn): Sometimes it's not even for people who actually fit and whom other people think ARE Gorean.. heh heh